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Talmud Study - Lesson 10

The Oath Transfer

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Talmud Study - Lesson 10: The Oath Transfer

In this class we conclude studying and clarifying the Mishnah which was introduced in an attempt to challenge "Rav Huna's Oath."
Handouts:
 Lesson 10: Handout  
Lesson 10: Talmud Text  
Lesson 10: Talmud Text in English  
Related Text: Talmud - Bava Metzia: Bava Metzia 34b
Audio: Listen to Audio | Download this MP3
Topics: Bava Metzia, Talmud
Bava Metzia Talmud
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kameo April 17, 2011

Judaic law I might not get everything totally right, but what I do understand and love is the respect for sanctity of oaths, for people who try their best and the importance to make distinctions!

And the teacher Rabbi Wolf must have everything very clear to be able to make clearly to the student all those disticntions. At the moment we have the Wilders trial in Holland, and they are talking about a certain "dinner" what was said there and what was not said.

It is all about distinctions and analyzing unfortunately I am no lawyer (but than again maybe that is better :) ) Reply

Anonymous Chicago, IL June 30, 2010

Question on lesson 10 If the deposit was in stock, and the lender would not need to make an oath that he didn't covet the item, then the borrower would not need to, and could not, swear because it would be an unnecessary oath! The court could just find out what the current value of the item is! Please reply.
I would like to say that this class is great. It makes me think, and I love it. Please continue your work in teaching this ancient legal text to modern Jewry. Reply

Anonymous Killeen, TX June 29, 2010

The oath The oath should be upon the Lender since the item was in his custody. If the lender claims the item has been stolen. The question is how available the item in the market place. If the item is difficult to get or has some special sign or signature on it then the Lender should give an oath that it is not in his possession. For example the Apple ipod the lender might want to pay for it and keep the ipod for him self because he was not willing to stay in a line for ten hours or more.
Since the borrower could get the value of the item wrong since he does not have the item in his possession and does not know the condition of the item an oath for the value of the item should not come from the borrower. Reply

luther nashman ny, ny/usa June 29, 2010

lesson 10 oaths/Rabbi Wolf I have been told that in Israel today officers commissioned into the army attest their allegiance to the state rather than make an oath to the state because of the biblical restrictions. Why not also use this technique in rabbinical courts and solve the biblical problems?.. Reply

Anonymous Killeen, Tx June 29, 2010

Talmud Study Lesson 9 The question how the ownership is in questions when this is a new situation from the last five questions with an ox goring a cow and maybe the Fetus. There is not give information on the type of guardians and their willingness to paid. The original owner is the owner and base on this information none of the guardians would be liable and since the the ox gore the cow and maybe the fetus and the guardians did not voice to pay for it therefore the owner is to the original owner. Reply

Anonymous NF, NY June 28, 2010

laws of today I know many of the laws of today are based on the Talmud, but am curious, the interpretation is still personal. Why have judges if they're going to not abide by the laws? As I see it, each judge has different "opinions" and therefore will interpret the law the way they see fit; so having a very secular Judge will affect who goes to jail many times when a religious person seeks help from the Courts! And if affects who goes to jail versus who goes free! Reply

Rivka Ziino Barrington, USA June 28, 2010

Lesson 10 I am enjoying this class very much. I think the discussion concerning not causing anyone to make a vain oath or any false oath is based on what was believed to be human nature before G-d. It would be interesting to apply this Talmudic case to people like B. Madoff Reply

luther nashman ny, ny/usa June 28, 2010

Lesson #10 Court cases I understand that in Israel today,disputes can be resolved by either regular courts or rabbinical courts. Do the rabbinical courts follow the talmudic interpretations when applicable to the case exactly ? Reply

Kayo Tokyo, Japan June 28, 2010

Very Much Enjoyed With your handout, it is easy to follow and understand the logic. I enjoyed the class very much. Reply

Maria Martinez Monte Vista, Colorado June 24, 2010

Talmud For Beginners Lesson 10 Rabbi Wolf, Thank you for the lecture. I learned new things and am looking forward to Lesson 11. Reply

luther nashman new york, ny/usa June 24, 2010

Lesson number #10 While the discussion was very interesting on a theoretical plane, the connection to present day practices is limited. If the loan to the borrower requires collateral to be tranferred to the lender, then the loan has a significant value. All lenders would routinely evaluate the collateral and resolve all potential disputes before any loan was even made. The other thing bothering me is that only if an oath is given in regard to any statement, is it considered to be legally truthful. The validity and responsibility for one's statements alone apparantly mean nothing if it is part a rabbinical court case. Reply

Talmud for Beginners
These Talmud classes will be studying and analyzing the third chapter of tractate Bava Metzia, which presents the Jewish approach in many matters of civil law, particularly vis-à-vis the different degrees of liability assumed by guardians, renters and borrowers.
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